targeting musky with ontario conservation lic

[John Pensyl]

Earlier this year we were stopped in Ontario waters and informed we needed a copy of our printed conservation Lic to accompany the outdoors card. Easy fix, but today Cullen and our friend danny were stopped again and told legally they could not target muskies in Ontario waters with a conservation Lic. Because the way the law is written possession must remain at zero and while releasing a musky possession is 1... What??? Anybody ever hear of this?? Just checked the web and I guess its not a new argument, but who is right????

[Stephen Glassic]

It seems that the regulation guide does not clearly define the meanings of possession and immediate release.

Someone could interpret possession as being as soon as you bring it into the boat or within a certain period of time after bringing it into the boat. Others may even interpret as having it in a net.  Even if you never bring it into the boat.  Others may interpret it as being after a certain period of time after you put it in a net or bring it into the boat.

Immediate release, as far as I can see, is never defined.  Someone may interpret it as cutting the line(extreme interpretation).  Someone else may interpret it as keeping it in the net, removing the hooks and immediately releasing it (possibly with or without revival to ensure it's survival).  Others may interpret it as release it within a reasonable amount of time, allowing time for an in boat measurement and a photograph.

There seems to be a bit of an explanation on the OMNR website page that defines the difference between a regular fishing license and a conservation license but not in the regulation guide but there is nothing that explains at what point it is considered possession.

 

[Scott McKee]

Here's the reply to an E-mail I sent the OMNR  regarding Cullen's experience with an OMNR officer and fishing for muskies with an Ontario Conservation License:

Dear Mr. Mckee:

 

Thank you for your recent email inquiring about the legality of angling for muskellunge under the authority of a Conservation licence.  I am pleased to respond on behalf of the Honourable Michael Gravelle, Minister of Natural Resources.

 

I am not aware of the circumstances of your friend’s recent encounter with a Conservation Officer but, even though the muskellunge catch limit for the holder of a Conservation licence is zero, an angler may legally angle for muskellunge.  Any muskellunge which are caught must be immediately released.

 

I hope this clarifies the regulations on this issue.  Best of luck for the remainder of the fishing season.

 

Sincerely,

 

 

Eric Boysen

Director

Biodiversity Branch

 

c:         Hon. Michael Gravelle

Minister of Natural Resources

[Frank Stachowiak]

Thanks Tony for your research and input. An immediate release of a musky is not considered a violation of the Conservation License restrictions.  I think taking a photo of a hand held musky could be considered a violation. Depending on the kind of photo thos officers looked at, they might have been able to issue a citation. My advice to conservation license holders: water release your fish.

[Tony Scime]

If taking an out-of-water picture is illegal with a Conservation license, then it is illegal for any under-sized fish (under 54 inches in many waters now) no matter what type of license you have, and totally illegal in Catch and Release only waters such as Lac Seul. Such pictures are everywhere and have been for many years. The OMNR (as opposed to anglers on internet discussion boards) have never suggested out-of-water pictures are illegal as long as the fish is "immediately" released in a manner insuring it's survival.

Water release is an optimal practice none-the-less.

[John Pensyl]

Just be aware that there are OMNR officers that do not know the ins and outs of there own regulations. I've been there before with our own nys Dec officers while goose hunting in late November a few years back. I had to break out the regulations guide and a map to prove we were within the open zones boundaries and avoid what could have been thousands of dollars in fines. It took 2 hours out of our day and cut what was an amazing am hunt a few birds short. Just as it cut cullens morning fishing trip short when he was incorrectly asked to stop targeting muskies in Canadian waters. I now know to be prepared to argue the issue should the occasion ever present itself again, hopefully not. Thank you Scott for taking the time to email the right people to get a positive answer.

[Bob Piazza]

To make matters worse, I was just reading a paper from the 1000 islands and they are fining boaters for not having paper nautical charts on board if they are non residents on the river even if they have an onboard GPS. The theory goes what happens if the GPS stops working. What a hassle fishing Canada nowadays. It never used to be like this. Damn.

[John Miller]

I recently heard that Chris D. was pulled over by Canadien authorities and told that he can not target muskies with a conservation license.  I have been stopped by Canadien authorities on several occasions and they have never utterred a word about targeting muskies with a conservation license or the need to call the can-pass number.  I will not change my current routine of not calling before I fish for muskies with my conservation license.  It is unfortunate that there are some officers who are confused about the laws.  I hope they straighten this out soon.

[Frank Stachowiak]

John, I'm curious about the Canadian authorities who have stopped you on several occasions. If they weren't concerned about the type of license you had  or ask for a Canpass report number, what was the reason for the stop?? Was it just to check to see if you had a license? By the way has anyone received a hard copy of their Canadian license??? 
John Miller said:

I recently heard that Chris D. was pulled over by Canadien authorities and told that he can not target muskies with a conservation license.  I have been stopped by Canadien authorities on several occasions and they have never utterred a word about targeting muskies with a conservation license or the need to call the can-pass number.  I will not change my current routine of not calling before I fish for muskies with my conservation license.  It is unfortunate that there are some officers who are confused about the laws.  I hope they straighten this out soon.

[Scott McKee]

If you order your Ontario license on-line you are required to print the PDF file provided.  We should carry our Ontario Outdoors Card and this printed PDF file.  Please make me aware of any instances where an OMNR officer tells you it is illegal to target muskies with a Conservation License.  It is legal and I the E-mail I pasted above proves that. Please get the officer's name if there is a problem so that we can get his straitened out.

[John Miller]

Frank, you know they never really addressed why they were stopping me.  They ask for fishing licenses and then boat registration and visually check for PFD's.  Probably your basic regulations and boat safety check.   

Frank Stachowiak said:

John, I'm curious about the Canadian authorities who have stopped you on several occasions. If they weren't concerned about the type of license you had  or ask for a Canpass report number, what was the reason for the stop?? Was it just to check to see if you had a license? By the way has anyone received a hard copy of their Canadian license??? 
John Miller said:

I recently heard that Chris D. was pulled over by Canadien authorities and told that he can not target muskies with a conservation license.  I have been stopped by Canadien authorities on several occasions and they have never utterred a word about targeting muskies with a conservation license or the need to call the can-pass number.  I will not change my current routine of not calling before I fish for muskies with my conservation license.  It is unfortunate that there are some officers who are confused about the laws.  I hope they straighten this out soon.

[Scott McKee]

Here's another E-mail i received from the OMNR:

Thank you for your email dated July 28, 2012.  I am pleased to respond and apologize for the delay in response.

 

To clarify your inquiry regarding angling for muskellunge, there have been no recent changes to the regulations related to this topic.  Licensed anglers are permitted to fish for any species of fish during the open season for that species.  Where there is a zero quota (limit), as there is for those fishing for muskellunge under a Conservation Fishing Licence, then the angler must immediately return the fish to the water in a manner that causes the least harm to the fish.

 

I appreciate your taking the time to ensure that you and your members are properly following the regulations for fishing muskellunge and hope that the above response helps to answer your concerns.

 

Sincerely,

 

 

Lois Deacon

Director, Enforcement Branch

Ministry of Natural Resources